sure, in retrospect now knowing we finished 8-22.
but going in and trying to win games, we had Dusan and AP (plus Soulis) as big forwards. there was no way to get even one of the freshmen forwards minutes, much less 10-15 each.
25-26 Roster Expectations
- Thread starter *23*
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but going in and trying to win games, we had Dusan and AP (plus Soulis) as big forwards. there was no way to get even one of the freshmen forwards minutes, much less 10-15 each.
97spiderfan
Bench player
Sure, we as fans didn't know how empty the minutes we were going to get from Dusan, AP, and Soulis, but damn well Mooney should have known that. And again if they couldn't beat out AP and Collin Tanner for minutes, that probably should be red flag as to their long term prospects. Mooney assures us they "could" be really really good though, so I guess we will see.
Mojo-Spider
Bench player
Have we ever had a red shirt freshman make a significant first playing year impact in the Mooney era?
Go Spiders!
the way the season went, I'm sure Mooney wished he could have used them last spring.
but both JRob and McG chose the redshirt. it's a smart business decision for them. get paid NIL to go to class, lift and work on their game. still have 4 years left. come back better in your 2nd year. if they ever blow up, parlay that into a much bigger NIL either here or elsewhere. you can make much more in NIL then you can in the G-League and more than most make in Europe.
An expectation that freshmen UR signs are going to beat out upperclassman is overly optimistic. There is a big jump from high school ball to college and very few players are ready physically and mentally to make that jump. Players that can aren’t coming to UR to play.
Taking a year or two to mature, build strength, and understand the system seems reasonable to me. The problem is you have to have a pipeline and can’t constantly miss on recruits. The Spiders have not been able to land enough quality high school players and have been simply filling up the roster with long shots. Obviously I haven’t seen either of the 2 redshirts any more than anyone else has on the board, so I have nothing to go on but it is premature to determine that neither of them are improvements over the guys that played last year. The jury is still out on Collin Tanner as well. He got the opportunity to play last year and showed signs of improvement at the end of the season. We will see what he can bring this year. Having big contributions from Juniors and Seniors has typically been the formula for success for a mid-major program. The problem for Richmond has been that there haven’t been enough home grown Juniors and Seniors. The recruits have been leaving for lower level programs and the transfers have only been marginal successes (with a few exceptions).
the 15 man rosters and the NIL transfer market make tougher than ever for true freshmen to get time these days.
used to see clear openings for a good freshman. now in the spring you open your wallet and bring in a 22 year old to fill any holes. not many 18 year olds are beating out an experienced junior/senior transfer that you just paid a lot for.
used to see clear openings for a good freshman. now in the spring you open your wallet and bring in a 22 year old to fill any holes. not many 18 year olds are beating out an experienced junior/senior transfer that you just paid a lot for.
MrTbone
Bench player
There’s actually no way to know this was the right move. Maybe they would’ve played 28 minutes total and wasted a year of eligibility. Or maybe one of them averages 12&7 and we go in with a well developed second year player.
It was a bad year so by that rationale it would’ve been a waste but we are going to struggle to win if we have to give guys a year of practice to learn our system.
not about giving them a year to learn. it was that at the start of the year they were buried. we had high expectations for the guys ahead of them. sure, at some point we could have pulled the trigger. but we weren't sitting Dusan, AP and Roche to play the freshmen. we were trying to win games.
I'm saying it was the right move for the freshmen's careers. they should be a lot better this year as redshirt freshmen than they would have been last year.
Spider17
Starter
It would’ve been a shame to burn their redshirts and lose a year of eligibility to play a few minutes in a lost season. Also, not a good sign for our program if we get into the habit of redshirting a lot of freshmen and none are able to contribute meaningfully their freshman year.
So, going in trying to win games, we chose to go with 3 non athletic guys, one who had 81 career minutes played, and another who had 10 career minutes played, because there was no way a couple more athletic freshmen could have gotten any minutes over them?
Especially from game 1. We were struggling big time in OOC play, and it was obvious the roster was non athletic and just not mixing well. This is when you need a couple freshmen to be able to come in and make a difference heading into conference play. Yet ours were already being redshirted. I will never understand that decision.
They "chose" their redshirt after the idea was mentioned to them. We should have played things out, let the freshmen keep practicing everyday knowing mentally they might be part of the rotation. And, if not from game 1, after a few ugly OOC games when it was obvious our current guys were gonna win about 8 games, give them a chance. If we are trying to win like you said, why not change things up and see what our rotation looks like heading into A-10 play? If they play well, they get great experience, make us a better team, and give us a boost and some hope last season. If they don't play well, and don't look like they can be good players for us, at least we know heading into the portal and the season this year, what to expect from them.
I agree there is no way to know if this were the right decision for them. Like you said, maybe one (or even both) play well last year. That would almost guarantee them playing time this year. Last year, they pretty much needed to beat out inexperienced Tanner and inexperienced AP for playing time. Now, they need to beat out experienced Tanner and experienced AP for playing time, and we added Daughtry, who will get minutes at F like Dusan did last year. We also added other transfers and freshmen who could hurt their playing time, especially if we go with 3 guard lineups. Last year might have been the best chance for these guys to get good playing time and show what they can do.
*23*
Starter
Agree with everything here. Absolutely no need to take this hard stance at start of year that they were not playing. Should have at least let it play out. And to your point on the other post - it may well have gave them a toe hold on some playing time this year. Now Bryson seemingly behind Tanner and AJ on the wing.
Section9_RowD
Starter
We'll see what happens in the next two weeks - rightly or wrongly, expect 1 if not 2 of the incoming freshman to redshirt and we can have this whole debate again through the seaso
97spiderfan
Bench player
And if McGothin and Robinson don't get good time due to the portal and improvements other players made, maybe the freshman who are considering redshirting will think differently on their decisions. They should know being in practice all summer, who is in line to play good minutes.
*23*
Starter
I would fully expect Homenick to redshirt, barring injury to either Walz or Beagle. Sounds like Argabright might play, and the other two really are not in position it sounds like - but we shall see.
it's not like you declare it and sign some document. at any time, either could have played if coach felt they would get substantial time ... and if the freshmen wanted to use the year. both players chose to save the year.
I agree that redshirts are coming. It simply fits the “development model” that Mooney prefers. Every once in a blue moon there is a guard like Gilyard who steps in on day 1. Otherwise, it is a few garbage minutes here and there for any freshman that doesn’t redshirt.
The hope was that UR would be able to recruit higher rated HS players as the P4 raided the lower conferences via the transfer portal, but that has definitely not happened. Instead, there has been the same HS recruiting and filling in with transfers when the recruits fail to make the cut.
we'll have a clearer picture of who's available once the SoCon finishes up recruiting. /s
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