Wow. Really good point here, and a very telling post.
Portal Work
- Thread starter *23*
- Start date
Bingo. Good post and effort.
One great find with an immediate year one impact. Fool’s Gold.
97spiderfan
Starter
Not really. College basketball players are paid employees at this point, and frankly some of the highest paid employees of the University (which is so messed up in so many ways). So yeah, if they are not performing, bye bye. If they want to run college sports like a pro league, than you either earn your bag on the field/court and if you don't than you essentially get cut. I'm completely fine with that.
Why would I want to us to pay for instance Tanner $100K next year to be a mediocre player who does not help us win? Why would a NIL donor want to pay his salary after watching him play the past 3 years.
sman
Starter
don't think I ever mentioned his size. I'm saying I doubt we pay anyone who's not all-conference $500k. what do you raise him to the following year if he's actually on an all-conference team? I've already said he gets a big bump and will be the highest NIL guy on the roster ... unless we add an all-conference level guy in the portal.Agree. Sman fixated on his size. But he is straight baller, most similar to a KA. Super high hoops IQ. Sman probably would have passed up lil ol skinny Steph in the draft too. Just kidding sman, but u are underestimating in this case I think.
as good as he is, he isn't carrying us to anything. we need good players around him, and they cost money too.
sman
Starter
I can't imagine as a dad initiating a rational conversation where I suggest to my son ... a starter on a top 25 team in the ACC and with NBA aspirations ... that he transfer from freaking UNC to ANY team in the A10 much less a team currently 5-10 in that conference.
Spider3309
New recruit
$525,000
*23*
Assistant coach
Was he a starter before the injury?
*23*
Assistant coach
I didn't say his dad initiate the conversation. Maybe he doesn't like it there or dislikes Hubert, which knows. Again, the point is if we had a functioning GM he could take 5 minutes to make a call and gauge interest, get some Intel, plant a seed. Do this with 50 guys a month. We have no one doing this now. It only takes one or two Pasha's to Significantly upgrade our roster.
sman
Starter
don't know when the injury was, but he's started 20 of 28 games this year.
sman
Starter
my info is limited to a handful of guys who have gone through the portal. I don't think calling guys on rosters is a widespread as some people think. it gets wild as soon as you enter the portal, but the coaches I've heard about respect other coaches and aren't trying to poach anyone. I assume GMs follow this lead.
He likes it there and likes Hubert. And also likes the millions he makes. He is also from there, and his Mom played there. But, if he decided to leave for whatever reason, every top 10 program would pay big bucks to get him.
I want Nostradamus23 to tell us what kind of talent we will land in the portal, and what our record will be next year.
Looking at the A-10, u do not need a huge NIL budget to be at or near the top. We absolutely could win this league with the right coach and 2 million to spend. I don't see any team where I say, "wow, what a juggernaut, they are loaded with talent". The top 2 teams have a combined 3 Q1 wins. VCU is 0-5 Q1 and is 2nd in the A-10 at 12-3. There is no excuse, no anything that justifies us not being right up there with them.
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Eight Legger
Starter
Amen to all of that. Where does our women's program rank in NIL spending compared with every other A10 team? What about our lacrosse team? We're kicking ass in those sports, and those coaches don't make excuses -- they just make history.
sman
Starter
I'm not giving Mooney an excuse or a pass, but I don't understand this logic.
if we're offering $0.40 on the dollar compared to our competitors, expecting to outperform is unrealistic.
CM would have to do a masterful job ... and none of us expect that.
the #1 factor in being competitive these days is having an NIL advantage. and then using it properly to have more talent than the teams you play.
we should give ourselves the advantage. we're not LaSalle.
if we're offering $0.40 on the dollar compared to our competitors, expecting to outperform is unrealistic.
CM would have to do a masterful job ... and none of us expect that.
the #1 factor in being competitive these days is having an NIL advantage. and then using it properly to have more talent than the teams you play.
we should give ourselves the advantage. we're not LaSalle.
Eight Legger
Starter
Two things I would say:
• The teams that spend the most don't win every conference title and don't win every professional championship. If that were the case, it would be easy to figure out how to win. But there's a lot more that goes into it than just spending money.
• If we believe that money IS the most important factor to winning, and we know that we have more of it as a university and as an alumni base than any other A10 school, then why is more of it not available? Are we as a school intentionally handcuffing ourselves? Or do our donors simply not feel motivated to give money to a coach who has proven over 2 decades that he's basically just average?
• The teams that spend the most don't win every conference title and don't win every professional championship. If that were the case, it would be easy to figure out how to win. But there's a lot more that goes into it than just spending money.
• If we believe that money IS the most important factor to winning, and we know that we have more of it as a university and as an alumni base than any other A10 school, then why is more of it not available? Are we as a school intentionally handcuffing ourselves? Or do our donors simply not feel motivated to give money to a coach who has proven over 2 decades that he's basically just average?
brooklyn brownstone
Starter
So, to pile on these thoughts, based on UR's history and Moon's specific history, we need a core of multi-year players and to add one basically 2 starters and one or two additional depth guys as 1 year guys. So really, we're talking about building a roster and spending our NIL over a 2 year period to build a team that Moon may be able to have success with.
Let's look at the A10 reg. season winning team for a possible formula. As we can see here, the bulk of what we want to spend should be on the starters. Harris, Tyne and Roche had moments but were pretty much clear bench role players. Noyes started for awhile, then was hurt and limited and somehow fell off the radar. Can't properly evaluate how that went. But maybe have a decent NIL budget for a quality 6th man, that is more than the role player types or freshmen HS recruits.
Starters
Dji 4th year (HS recruit)
Quinn 2nd year (portal)
Bigs 2nd year (portal)
King 1st year (portal)
Hunt 1st year (portal)
Bench:
Tyne 1st year (HS recruit)
Roche (2nd year, portal)
Harris 1st year (portal)
Noyes (3rd year HS recruit)
Overall, I agree that when looking at it through the lens of budgeting for a winning team that probably the vast majority of the budget should to to the top 5-6 guys. Role players are needed but should be available for cheap via portal (Harris types). HS guys will be depth pieces or rotation guys if good enough, but still cheap - they have large value in an NIL world and have real upside IMO. Essentially the equivalent of a rookie contract in the pros.
So even a $2m budget seems workable to me. Of course, player identification/evaluation (and actually landing them via portal) is another whole thing, both for portal and HS recruiting.
Let's look at the A10 reg. season winning team for a possible formula. As we can see here, the bulk of what we want to spend should be on the starters. Harris, Tyne and Roche had moments but were pretty much clear bench role players. Noyes started for awhile, then was hurt and limited and somehow fell off the radar. Can't properly evaluate how that went. But maybe have a decent NIL budget for a quality 6th man, that is more than the role player types or freshmen HS recruits.
Starters
Dji 4th year (HS recruit)
Quinn 2nd year (portal)
Bigs 2nd year (portal)
King 1st year (portal)
Hunt 1st year (portal)
Bench:
Tyne 1st year (HS recruit)
Roche (2nd year, portal)
Harris 1st year (portal)
Noyes (3rd year HS recruit)
Overall, I agree that when looking at it through the lens of budgeting for a winning team that probably the vast majority of the budget should to to the top 5-6 guys. Role players are needed but should be available for cheap via portal (Harris types). HS guys will be depth pieces or rotation guys if good enough, but still cheap - they have large value in an NIL world and have real upside IMO. Essentially the equivalent of a rookie contract in the pros.
So even a $2m budget seems workable to me. Of course, player identification/evaluation (and actually landing them via portal) is another whole thing, both for portal and HS recruiting.
Spider17
All A-10 player
Like I’ve said before, more money obviously is better than having less money but I think about it as zones. A team with 2 million isn’t necessarily going to do better than a team with 1 million or worse than 3 million. Case and point, Dayton is under achieving relative to a $5 million roster (lost to La Salle) and Loyola Chicago is supposedly towards the top in NIL and dead last.
Mooney’s argument would hold a lot more water if we were consistently beating the teams we’re supposed to (like Elon, Charleston Southern) and basically only losing to P5 teams or other teams in A10 who are spending more. The staff doesn’t want to schedule P5 teams, we all know why, and we aren’t just under performing relative to the top dogs in NIL in A10 but with the majority of A10. We aren’t in 5th or 6th consistently try to break into top 4. We’ve been bottom 4 team 3 out of past 4 years. Heck, we even came 1st in regular season a couple years ago. So it shows it can be done. We just don’t have a coach who can recruit and develop players on a consistent basis to maintain that. Seems like that was just an anomaly where we got lucky.
Mooney’s argument would hold a lot more water if we were consistently beating the teams we’re supposed to (like Elon, Charleston Southern) and basically only losing to P5 teams or other teams in A10 who are spending more. The staff doesn’t want to schedule P5 teams, we all know why, and we aren’t just under performing relative to the top dogs in NIL in A10 but with the majority of A10. We aren’t in 5th or 6th consistently try to break into top 4. We’ve been bottom 4 team 3 out of past 4 years. Heck, we even came 1st in regular season a couple years ago. So it shows it can be done. We just don’t have a coach who can recruit and develop players on a consistent basis to maintain that. Seems like that was just an anomaly where we got lucky.
