Game Thread - Davidson @ RC Sat 1/31 4:30 PM (USA Network)

[Spider17]

Only problem with letting him hang around in an administrative role is that he will be involved in picking his replacement (can you say former player).

I get where you’re coming from and can understand wanting to start completely fresh. I’m just saying that in order for the administration to do something they’ve never done before in the history of this school, which is end a coach’s contract early, will require some conditions. For me the conditions PQ/Mooney/and admin would want to save face are this. 1) it’s worded as a mutual decision or Mooney’s decision to step down 2) Mooney still gets paid 3) he remains involved in the University in some way. I don’t know if that means helping pick the coach or not.

I think that’s a compromise that works for all parties. People who want to save face for Mooney and people who want him fired.

For those who have wanted Mooney fired for years, are those above conditions satisfactory? In other words would you rather have a new coach next year under the conditions I listed above or have Mooney stay another 3 years and leave when his contract expires, but then he doesn’t remain with the university/help pick the new coach? Because the only way I can see having any new coaching change for next year is the first option.

 

[Spiderguy]

Jeez - from some of the posts, it seems like we have to dance lightly over dealing with Mooney. At what point does the future of the basketball program, the alumni, the school, and fan base take priority over CM? It's one thing to showing some level of respect and decency. It's another to treat him with kid gloves. He's benefited tremendously professionally and financially quite well over the years. Isn't he the the highest paid individual at UR? With that should come the highest of expectations. I don't know what or even if he has performance goals, but if he does, who thinks he's meeting those? I'd say he's well on the better side of the ledger vs his employer & fans. How many businesses would operate this way in the real world? At some point business must matter more than propping him up. We're beyond that at this point.

 

[sman]

1) it’s worded as a mutual decision or Mooney’s decision to step down. sure. no reason not to.

2) Mooney still gets paid. of course. that's what a guaranteed contract guarantees.

3) he remains involved in the University in some way. I don’t know if that means helping pick the coach or not. don't see why he'd want that. as what, a General Manager? can't see it. it's the busy work without the headline. and no, picking a new coach is too important. you go with a "seach firm" to identify top guys for Hardt (and probably PQ) to talk to.

 

[Eight Legger]

I think you offer him the buyout and allow him to take a "retirement" option with some type of other role in the AD's office if that's the only way to mitigate whatever we would otherwise owe him. But you do NOT give him any ability to pick the next coach.

It really all depends what we owe him, and no one knows that. We may have to tread somewhat lightly to get him out on good financial terms for the school, or if there's not much money still owed, we can just fire him and eat it (even though that's not been our M.O. before).

 

[RichmondNative]

Jeez - from some of the posts, it seems like we have to dance lightly over dealing with Mooney. At what point does the future of the basketball program, the alumni, the school, and fan base take priority over CM? It's one thing to showing some level of respect and decency. It's another to treat him with kid gloves. He's benefited tremendously professionally and financially quite well over the years. Isn't he the the highest paid individual at UR? With that should come the highest of expectations. I don't know what or even if he has performance goals, but if he does, who thinks he's meeting those? I'd say he's well on the better side of the ledger vs his employer & fans. How many businesses would operate this way in the real world? At some point business must matter more than propping him up. We're beyond that at this point.

Totally agree. Mooney is a highly compensated coach and is delivering a bottom four team in the A10, a competitive but far from elite conference. He simply is not earning his pay.

The problem is UR athletics aren’t run like a regular business. There is one wealthy donor calling all the shots as as long as he is paying the bills, the coach is who he wants it to be. The administration has nothing it can say as from a balance sheet perspective the coach is “free”. As long as there are no negative implications to the University, all is well.

I think the vision of Men’s basketball being the premier sport at the University of Richmond is no more. The problem is no one told the fan base. This also is logical because communications is the Achilles heel of the Athletic Department. Perhaps the rationale for keeping a lame duck Men’s basketball coach is a subtle way to shift the focus. The “giant killers” of……..lacrosse - the goal is to be known as a top tier lacrosse school now. It fits the narrative and profile of the school and the dollars go further in a smaller niche sport. It even makes “business sense”.

Sure there were also investments in some basketball facilities, but again where did the funding come from? A small price to pay and many of the upgrades benefit all the sports programs including lacrosse. It has been a bonus that the Women’s team has leveraged the new practice facility along with its motivated coach.

Sorry Spider Hoops fans the new era has begun.

 

[*23*]

Some good points Native. PQ bought us a practice facility and funded other basketball related activities I believe. Moons salary is just a small piece of that. If I recall, Hardt and PQ's kids were roommates at some point. It's all tight nit PQ run department with the focus on leafy and lacrosse.

Oh well, at least we have a nice shiny new message board to keep griping.

 

[Spiderguy]

Some good points Native. PQ bought us a practice facility and funded other basketball related activities I believe. Moons salary is just a small piece of that. If I recall, Hardt and PQ's kids were roommates at some point. It's all tight nit PQ run department with the focus on leafy and lacrosse.

Oh well, at least we have a nice shiny new message board to keep griping.

Sounds like Spider Ball is PQ’s vanity project.

 

[ManiBenton]

1) it’s worded as a mutual decision or Mooney’s decision to step down. sure. no reason not to.

2) Mooney still gets paid. of course. that's what a guaranteed contract guarantees.

3) he remains involved in the University in some way. I don’t know if that means helping pick the coach or not. don't see why he'd want that. as what, a General Manager? can't see it. it's the busy work without the headline. and no, picking a new coach is too important. you go with a "seach firm" to identify top guys for Hardt (and probably PQ) to talk to.

When Mooney finally leaves this program, I want him as far as possible. We don’t need the “we competed” mindset anymore

 

[SpiderLaw]

Davidson is leading St Louis at the half

 

[MrTbone]

There’s a point where the results are too bad to ignore even for our admin. I think that billboard only galvanized support for Mooney and just gave the admin any more reason to keep him. UR is very averse to public criticism. The only way change will occur is if there is a level of apathy seen in attendance/decrease donations that can’t be ignored. The second thing is PQ has to sign off on it I’m sure. So that’s why I wouldn’t be surprised if he stays next year and we just go through the same thing again.

To me, disrespectful isn’t letting someone go. Disrespectful in my eyes is something like VCU firing their women’s coach when there’s one month left in the season and not even letting her finish it out.

I would argue that what’s disrespectful in our case is letting Mooney continue to coach, have a couple more 13-15 win seasons that will only worsen his record and hurt his legacy more. A win-win situation is Mooney steps down on his own terms, we pay out the rest of his contract, allow him to remain involved with the university in some way, and we find someone else to lead our basketball program.

I can guarantee that if/when Mooney is no longer going to be our basketball coach, we will never word it as “firing” or “terminating” his contract. That is a testament to his 20+ years here and that’s the classy thing to do and I agree with that.

on the last bit. He won’t get fired or terminated, it’ll be some kind of amicable split. I just hope we aren’t waiting until the contract actually runs out.

 

[Gkiller]

If he steps down no he doesn’t get paid everything in his contract. Hopefully we have buyout but our AD & admins r nincompoops so I’m highly skeptical of that. Sure offer a negotiated settlement to step down but why give him it all if he’s retiring or transitioning that’s bad business & insane to me. If I were Moon I wouldn’t leave $ on table he has the leverage but if it becomes a “mutual” decision no u don’t get all of it nor should it work that way. Put on some big boy pants eat the $ you’ll make it back or it’s just a minuscule line item for the accountants.

 

[SpiderLaw]

Davidson is leading St Louis at the half

Billikens win 91-82

 

[MrTbone]

If he steps down no he doesn’t get paid everything in his contract. Hopefully we have buyout but our AD & admins r nincompoops so I’m highly skeptical of that. Sure offer a negotiated settlement to step down but why give him it all if he’s retiring or transitioning that’s bad business & insane to me. If I were Moon I wouldn’t leave $ on table he has the leverage but if it becomes a “mutual” decision no u don’t get all of it nor should it work that way. Put on some big boy pants eat the $ you’ll make it back or it’s just a minuscule line item for the accountants.

I’m still holding on to the slim hope that someone had an ounce of common sense with the last extension and designed a release clause in it somewhere.

Dreamers gonna dream.